KITAS sponsored by the Indonesian spouse

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  • Cabral
    Member
    • Apr 2012
    • 20

    Hello everyone

    I'm new to the discussion here, although I've been living in Indonesia for almost 6 years. In short this is my situation.
    Married to an Indonesian wife, legally, for almost 4 years. I have always been living on SosBud visa's and getting most of my money abroad while working in collaboration with Indonesian NGO's or arts-organizations. Since we have one son now and a second one coming up, we want to get settled and once and for all get all this, or at least some uncertainty out of the way. Imagining me being arrested and deported while my wife is here with our two very young children does not sound nice at all.

    I am changing my NGO sponsored SosBud to a SosBud sponsored by my wife and then I am going to take the steps to turn that in a KITAS, I've talked this through with bapak Rezeki at the Yogyakarta Immigration office and it seems that will work. He has looked at my papers and foresees no problems. The next step is then being able to work. A small NGO in Jakarta wants to continue working with me, but is not sure they can offer me a year's contract, could be 4,5 months or so. I have an idea of starting little on the side activities, designing and offering courses/workshops, monitoring/evaluation type jobs and possibly teaching, to earn some extra money.

    How do I get a working permit that does allow me to do these things? In other words become a free-lance worker in Indonesia. Should I start up my own PT/company and then get hired by the NGO and other institutions? Should the NGO request an IMTA for one year, and we make it seem that the other activities are also part of the NGO work? Should we start a "creative consultancy" company on my wife's name and then I just become her employee? Under the creative consultancy flag I could do all kinds of work I guess?

    Well I hope anyone has some advice for me, because we are a little but lost as to what is the best road to take. ON the 8th of may DEPNAKERTRANS and IMMIGRATION have invited me to come to a sosialisasi about the new immigration laws and their effects for MANPOWER,TAXES and IMMIGRATION matters. They have simply invited all mixed couples in Yogyakarta to come. I think it's good to go there and listen what the new regulations are, but after reading Atlantis (who is blessed for helping all of us here) comments on the factual changes of the new laws I have little hope that just holding a KITAS or KITAP based on my marriage will allow me to work. The big problem is that the often little NGO's I work for, all hate the tiresome bureaucracy, they are willing and would like to work with me, but if all the paperwork becomes too much hassle, well they rather hire someone else......sad but true....also they are a little afraid, hiring one foreigner seems to have a lot of consequences, what if something goes wrong? They're not used to all this hassle, they're used to setting up a SPK (Surat Perintah Kerja) which has all details on the job and then we can just start. Wish it would be so simple for me....

    Looking forward to hearing some advise

    Regards
    Cabral

    Comment

    • KanpieBatam
      Member
      • Mar 2012
      • 38

      Originally posted by Cabral View Post
      I'm new to the discussion here,

      I am changing my NGO sponsored SosBud to a SosBud...

      How do I get a working permit...

      Well I hope anyone has some advice for me...

      Looking forward to hearing some advise...

      Regards
      Cabral
      Hi Cabral, I am no moderator but I would say, if you want answers it would be better to keep your post short and sweet, working your way issue by issue. What have you done to improve your situation since your last post? Any changes or actions on your end?

      I am new too on this forum. I won't be able to answer your questions. I just sympatize with you because your post doesn't have any answers and your situation is serious.

      Comment

      • Cabral
        Member
        • Apr 2012
        • 20

        Dear Kanpie Batam

        I am flying to KL this sunday, where I will get a SOSBUD visa on the name of my wife. Be back on wednesday and then going directly to KANIM Yogya to change the SOSBUD to a KITAS. In terms of the working permit, I'll have to wait until the KITAS comes through.
        Those are the latest. 08 May I have been invited to come to a sosialisasi by IMIGRASI and DEPNAKERTRANS about mix-marriage couples.

        Comment

        • marcus
          Member
          • Jul 2008
          • 9238

          Cabral , if you still don't know , the new Immigration Law didn't change much in relation to work . Although some immigration officers say you could work with a KITAS sponsored by Indonesian spouse and without a work permit , the officers from Manpower Minister's office say the work permit is still required .
          If Manpower is not convinced to revise their regulation to be more in line with the Immigration Law (Article 61) , the situation of many people like you will continue to be a difficult one .
          The solution of setting up a business is not always a solution for everybody's case too , because there are cases where a work permit will not be possible due to the work rule limitations .

          Comment

          • KanpieBatam
            Member
            • Mar 2012
            • 38

            Hi Marcus, just to double check with you reading your post made me think about my situation.

            My business is online, all my customers are in my country of origin. Nothing local. Is that a problem with a spousal sponsorship with a KITAS? I don't have my NPWP yet. I've been living in Batam since 2 years now.

            Thanks.

            Comment

            • marcus
              Member
              • Jul 2008
              • 9238

              Originally posted by KanpieBatam View Post
              ..My business is online, all my customers are in my country of origin. Nothing local. Is that a problem with a spousal sponsorship with a KITAS? ...
              I believe your case is the safest regarding not having a work permit . Anyway , better keep it a secret and don't spread evidence around your house .

              Besides the partial protection of UU6 - 2011 , Article 61 , as Atlantis said , the Manpower officer's argument that a work permit is necessary is difficult to be supported when a work permit is not applicable (as the work permit is only issued to companies based in Indonesia) . In addition , you are not taking a job from an Indonesian , which I think is the main reason behind the work permit requirement .

              Comment

              • mrcibubur
                Member
                • Feb 2009
                • 1057

                There are two aspects about Kanpie Batams comments which I think merit further discussion on a separate Thread. The first is what is perceived as an overseas business run online on the internet and the second is tax liability for income earned.

                Atlantis pulled me up, quite recently, and quite justifiably, for not having registered for the NPWP Tax Card and drawing my attention to the fact that the authorities here may ask to see Bank Statements or evidence of overseas income (I think that is what he meant) if the foreigner living in Indonesia is not permitted to work and therefore does not have any disclosable income from a source of work in Indonesia.

                There are an entrepreneurial air about everyone in the world nowadays who is even remotely familiar with Ebay or Khaskus or Garage Sales, Google Adsense and the list goes on and on ...... If USA cannot pass leglislation such as SOPA to handle it, what chance does Indonesia?

                Then again, we live in Indonesia and we live or die by the sword, so if the Indonesian authorities tell any one of us we are working illegally here in such a way, try arguing otherwise or have the financial means to fight the battle. We are here in Indonesia, is the simple truth, and we must lie on the bed we made, however uncomfortable at times it may be.

                Comment

                • atlantis
                  Banned
                  • Jul 2008
                  • 16593

                  Originally posted by mrcibubur View Post
                  There are two aspects about Kanpie Batams comments which I think merit further discussion on a separate Thread. The first is what is perceived as an overseas business run online on the internet and the second is tax liability for income earned.

                  Atlantis pulled me up, quite recently, and quite justifiably, for not having registered for the NPWP Tax Card and drawing my attention to the fact that the authorities here may ask to see Bank Statements or evidence of overseas income (I think that is what he meant) if the foreigner living in Indonesia is not permitted to work and therefore does not have any disclosable income from a source of work in Indonesia.

                  There are an entrepreneurial air about everyone in the world nowadays who is even remotely familiar with Ebay or Khaskus or Garage Sales, Google Adsense and the list goes on and on ...... If USA cannot pass leglislation such as SOPA to handle it, what chance does Indonesia?

                  Then again, we live in Indonesia and we live or die by the sword, so if the Indonesian authorities tell any one of us we are working illegally here in such a way, try arguing otherwise or have the financial means to fight the battle. We are here in Indonesia, is the simple truth, and we must lie on the bed we made, however uncomfortable at times it may be.
                  I have privy information which may be of interest to you (and quite a few other users) MrCibubur. However, bear in mind that it is still an unofficial information I got from a reliable source concerning the draft of the new Peraturan Pelaksanaan UU 6/2011. It seems that the government will back off from its will of requesting a document from the [COLOR=#000000][FONT=verdana]foreign embassies acknowledging the marriage of mixed couple as a prerequisite for KITAS/KITAP. At the moment, it is still required (as per Surat Ederan Ditjenim IMI3.UM.01.13.1.0404) but should be abandoned as soon a the PP get approved.
                  [/FONT][/COLOR]
                  A different source, as reliable as the first one, confirmed me that the plan is to submit the PP to SekNeg on May 4th, 2012 for legalization. However I have a slight doubt that they manage it. If it's delayed, it should be by only a few days. We are now very closed to the denouement.

                  Comment

                  • redsnapr
                    Member
                    • Jul 2008
                    • 1370

                    Your insider information is invaluable, Atlantis. This would indeed be great news for many who are encountering all sorts of difficulties trying to get this acknowledgement.
                    "Science is the philosophy of discovery. Intelligent design is a philosophy of ignorance"

                    Comment

                    • rich3276
                      Member
                      • Jun 2011
                      • 180

                      Attention please

                      [QUOTE=atlantis;9658][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]THIS POST HAS BEEN UPDATED IN APRIL 2009 AND JUNE 2010[/FONT][/COLOR]

                      [COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Since the publication of the new citizenship law a foreigner can be sponsored for residency by his indonesian wife. However the various regulations related to it seem not very well known by the Imigrasi around the country. It’s only in February 2007 that the ministerial decision no M.01-IZ.01.10 formally included foreign husbands joining their indonesian wives as being eligible for a KITAS.[/FONT][/COLOR]

                      [COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Though one could pick up a VITAS (sponsor istri) from a KBRI abroad, having previously obtained the agreement of the DitJen Imigrasi in JKT, I believe that the procedure described below is somewhat easier. It allows you plenty of time (you first enter on a SosBud, which can be extended up to 6 months) to convert it to an ITAS. Having almost 6 months to do so, it leaves almost no chance to the Imigrasi to try to extort bribes from you... It also offers the advantage of not having to exit Indonesia to get it.[/FONT][/COLOR]

                      [COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Here is the way to do it:[/FONT][/COLOR]

                      [COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]1[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]. The foreign husband get a Visa Kunjungan SosBud abroad, and get an Izin Kunjungan delivered for a first leg of 60 days at the port of entrance.[/FONT][/COLOR]
                      [COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]2[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]. The foreigner goes to his local KanIm (no mandatory waiting period of 4 months), along with his indonesian wife to apply for the conversion of his izin kunjungan in an ITAS. (Pasal 47 & Pasal 48* PP nomor 32 thn 1994)[/FONT][/COLOR]
                      [FONT=Verdana][COLOR=#000000][/COLOR][/FONT]
                      [COLOR=#ff0000][SIZE=3]Now here it is Attention please .....

                      [FONT=Verdana]Pasal 48 states very clear that we can only convert if we have been living at least 4 months in Indonesia continuously, that means at least 2 extensions are required on the third extension then an application can be made to convert to ITAS...
                      [/FONT]
                      If anyone does so remember also that your wife must register first the marriage at the Sipel, otherwise the application will be refused...[/SIZE]

                      [/COLOR]
                      In my case the application has been turned down, but I have made a complaint the last time I was at Imigrasi I tried to make ITAS and the imgrasi guy said he will not do, and must leave the country... I have reported this person and the manager is considering finding a solution to continue my ITAS application...

                      bye for now and thanks to all for the useful information....

                      Comment

                      • atlantis
                        Banned
                        • Jul 2008
                        • 16593

                        Originally posted by rich3276 View Post
                        [COLOR=#ff0000][SIZE=3]
                        [FONT=Verdana]Pasal 48 states very clear that we can only convert if we have been living at least 4 months in Indonesia continuously, that means at least 2 extensions are required on the third extension then an application can be made to convert to ITAS...
                        [/FONT]
                        If anyone does so remember also that your wife must register first the marriage at the Sipel, otherwise the application will be refused...[/SIZE]
                        [/COLOR]
                        This is wrong . The Pasal 48 originately was stating that 4 months were necessary BUT has been modified in October 2005 with the PP 38/2005. The amended article 48 reads:

                        Pasal 48
                        (2) Pengalihan status sebagaimana dimaksud pada ayat (1) diberikan berdasarkan permintaan orang asing yang bersangkutan dan sponsornya dengan syarat telah berada di wilayah Negara Republik Indonesia.

                        Thanks to verify your informations before posting in order not to confuse readers, especially if you decide to use red ink and big police of characters.
                        Last edited by atlantis; 01-05-12, 19:15.

                        Comment

                        • rich3276
                          Member
                          • Jun 2011
                          • 180

                          Originally posted by atlantis View Post
                          This is wrong . The Pasal 48 originately was stating that 4 months were necessary BUT has been modified in October 2005 with the PP 38/2005. The amended article 48 reads:

                          Pasal 48
                          (2) Pengalihan status sebagaimana dimaksud pada ayat (1) diberikan berdasarkan permintaan orang asing yang bersangkutan dan sponsornya dengan syarat telah berada di wilayah Negara Republik Indonesia.

                          Thanks to verify your informations before posting in order not to confuse readers, especially if you decide to use red ink and big police of characters.

                          I will take it to imigrasi tomorrow as you have stated not evan immigration are famiular with the laws of Indonesia,

                          My aim is not to confuse but to write the facts and my experience, I spent 4 hours at immigration going through this all, and it would have been advisable to of published it before to stop confusion.

                          Thanks for the infos I am excited to see the reactions at imigrasi tomorrow.....

                          no hard feelings you are doing a good job....

                          best wishes and no confusion i hope...

                          Comment

                          • atlantis
                            Banned
                            • Jul 2008
                            • 16593

                            Originally posted by rich3276 View Post
                            I I spent 4 hours at immigration going through this all, and it would have been advisable to of published it before to stop confusion.
                            It's all over the forum, in countless thread. I have given the link at list 20 times, possibly more. If you make a search just on this thread, you would find the link and an explanation concerning the amendment of PP 32/1994 quite a few times.
                            I even refer to the amendment in the OP!

                            What is dramatic is that 7 years after the amendment took place, some immigration clowns are still unaware of it when foreigners, who are not suppose to know better than them, are fully aware of it.

                            Comment

                            • rich3276
                              Member
                              • Jun 2011
                              • 180

                              Thanks again its just a jungle here, and I asked on page 43 if its is up to date I got the answer yes.... so I did not think there is any changes to pp48

                              Comment

                              • atlantis
                                Banned
                                • Jul 2008
                                • 16593

                                The answer which has been given to you at page 4[COLOR=#333333]3 is accurate: the OP was up to date and was stating that:

                                - no 4 months period is necessary (2. [/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Verdana]The foreigner goes to his local KanIm (no mandatory waiting period of 4 months), along with his indonesian wife to apply for the conversion of his izin kunjungan in an ITAS. (Pasal 47 & Pasal 48* PP nomor 32 thn 1994)[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#333333]

                                - the old article 48 was requiring a 4 months period but has been amended in 2005 (look at the bottom of the post the * which refer to the bolded above: [/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Verdana]* amended article in 2005. It reduces to nil the "waiting period" of 4 months previously mandatory before initiating the procedure.)

                                If you would have taken the time to read the thread, yu would have not been confused.

                                At post #7 in this thread:

                                [/FONT][/COLOR]
                                Originally posted by atlantis View Post
                                I will for sure keep you posted if I sort out this "4 months rule waiting period" thing. My bet is that the law that I quoted you in my last PM, which amended the article 48 of the Peraturan Pemerintah nomor 32 tahun 1994 IS valid... but that it did not reach (yet) the various Kantor Imigrasi in the country, since all Kantor Imigrasi I dealt with are requiring to follow the Article 48 in its old version. The law modifying it has been passed in... 2005, but is still considered apparently "too new" to be known or implemented!!!
                                Again at post #37 :


                                Again at post #54 :


                                ...etc

                                You obviously didn't read the thread nor researched the question.
                                Last edited by atlantis; 02-05-12, 05:27.

                                Comment

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